Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby EasterEggs » Thu Sep 15, 2011 1:44 pm

Just because I'm bored of staring at the shrimp alone I will post a photo so you can stare with me. :D

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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby Suzy » Thu Sep 15, 2011 9:31 pm

OMG! Look at her belly!

We should all guess how many larvae are in there, and then you have to count them and let us know who wins!


I guess 1262.
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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby EasterEggs » Fri Sep 16, 2011 1:25 am

1262? Oh my! You should see the other shrimp, it is hanging onto even more eggs! The other shrimp has silver eggs now, but I just checked and I don't see larvae in the trap right now and lights went out 2 hours ago. Maybe by morning. If the other one is still holding in the morning I will take pics of it. I should get some BS percolating.
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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby EasterEggs » Fri Sep 16, 2011 10:41 am

I have larvae! :D

I woke with a start this morning thinking, "Oh crap, I forgot to put brine shrimp on!" So I go rushing to the fish room to check the larvae trap. Nothing in there. Oh, well I guess I'm ok then. So I unplug the air pump, turn the powerheads back on, and look at the shrimp. One definitely released lastnight...dangit too many fish in the tank - they ate the larvae! Argh! But wait, what is this?? Something is in the larvae trap! It is larvae! They were all stuck to the screen when the air pump was on (should I turn the air down a bit then?). Wow, they are huge! CRAP, no brine shrimp! So I'm decapping brine right now.

There aren't a huge ton of the larvae...I'm guessing 100 maybe, but I haven't looked close either. I'm going to put them in a 1 gallon fish bowl with a bunch of plicatilis rotifers and hope for the best. If this doesn't work, there is another shrimp that should release tonight. Will be a good comparison.

These larvae are from the shrimp pictured above. Wish me luck please!
Last edited by EasterEggs on Fri Sep 16, 2011 3:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby Luis A M » Fri Sep 16, 2011 12:35 pm

Newly hatched shrimps can perfectly wait until your BBS hatch,not big deal.
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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby EasterEggs » Fri Sep 16, 2011 12:55 pm

Oh darn. I just added about 30 rots per mL about an hour ago. Do they not feed right away? I thought they did...I'll have to go freshen up on some breeding logs. Thanks for your input Luis. I read your threads on Reef Central too. :)

Any idea how long it takes to get the first of them to reach 1.25"? I understand they need to be graded because they grow at different speeds (thanks to Andy and Luis' conversation on RC). Was thinking I might disperse them around my clown growout tanks provided both are of a size they can't eat each other.

I made a video, but I can't figure out how to link to it without allowing viewing of all my other photos/videos.

Here are a couple pics. The graininess look in the larvae tank is the rotifers. I added just a sniff of RotiGreen Omega to the water so the rots have something to nibble on. The shrimp pictured is still holding, I think it will release tonight. Looks like a big batch!
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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby Suzy » Fri Sep 16, 2011 8:31 pm

Yahoo! You are on track to become Canada's major supplier of peppermints!

I really love your photos. They are great!
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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby EasterEggs » Sat Sep 17, 2011 10:40 am

Haha, that would be awesome Suzy! Right now though I can see it's going to take me a few tries to get the hang of this.

Lastnight when I turned the lights out and got the air pump going for the larval trap I had a brain fart and forgot to turn the pumps off and the LED on!! Ack! So out of that huge batch on the shrimp pictured above I only collected about 15 larvae. I just poured them in with yesterday's larvae.

The brine shrimp didn't hatch yesterday either...probably too cold. So they hatched overnight. I enriched them this morning as I figured many of them would be over 6 hours, and fed a bunch to the shrimp larvae. It's tough to tell how many are in there because I have so many rotifers in the tank. I don't see any dead shrimp though, so that's good!

There is one small shrimp holding eggs in the broodstock tank, but it is a way off of releasing.
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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby Suzy » Sat Sep 17, 2011 11:45 am

Great! The rots will be good food since you are keeping the water green.

Did you get a magnifying glass? They are amazing little alien creatures! They look way different as larvae.
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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby Luis A M » Sat Sep 17, 2011 4:27 pm

Have you seen this: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showt ... mint+larva
This shows the later stages Z4-Z11,where the fun begins 8) The species shown is L.boggessi,thou at that time I was not allowed to use the name :mrgreen:
If you learn to stage your zoea,you can track their development :wink:
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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby Suzy » Sat Sep 17, 2011 6:32 pm

Wow! Those are amazing photos, Luis! How did you get them?
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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby EasterEggs » Sat Sep 17, 2011 9:16 pm

Thanks for your responses Luis! :)

I have on order a 40x loupe and a 100x loupe from eBay. They are the tube style, not the magnifying glass style...I hope the design works ok. Once I have these magnifiers I will be able to see the larvae better, and hope to learn the zoea stages!

I can see the larvae eating brine shrimp, but the rotifers are too small to see in the shrimps' grasp, so I don't know if they are eating rotifers at all. I think I lost a few larvae today, but not a noticeable loss yet.

One thing I have noticed is major loss of BBS in the larvae tank. I think they are dead anyway...most of them are laying on the bottom of the larvae tank in a heap...there are few in the water column. I fear turning up the air bubbles would harm the shrimp larvae. I keep the bubbles going only fast enough to keep the shrimp larvae suspended in the water column. I do wonder if I should add an air stone to the larvae tank or the open rigid tubing is better?
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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby Luis A M » Sun Sep 18, 2011 12:50 am

Suzy,with my cheap scope and camera.But I was younger then! :mrgreen:
Eggs,Rhyne-Calado´s method doesn´t use air,it is an upweller.I don´t think rots are worth for them.
My easy staging rule (good from Z2 to Z7)is: number of walking legs+1=stage. :wink:
I am now raising some few Z8 boggessi zoeas.
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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby EasterEggs » Sun Sep 18, 2011 11:55 am

Hi Luis, I have been looking at Rhyne-Calado's kreisal, but I have yet to make heads nor tails out of it. All I can find is a 2D drawing. It seems information is limited...at least Googling "Calado upweller" isn't turning much up for me.

Now, if only they will hold still I could count their legs! I am glad to hear I am following along the footsteps of you Luis. Now, if I can keep up! :) How are you keeping the larvae? Calado style upweller? So far I am not sold on the goldfish bowl kreisal. The larvae get stuck in the rim that's around the bottom. I will try filling the bottom and see if that helps.

Yesterday was not a good day for the larvae. I lost about 80-90% yesterday afternoon/evening. There were several times during the day I checked on them and found I did not have the air turned up high enough and most of them were laying on the bottom. I believe this would be the cause of their demise, but maybe it is possible that food was an issue as they did not receive BBS until they were about 24-36 hours PH.

Luckily Peps breed like rabbits so I will be able to collect many larvae very often until I get this figure out.
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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby EasterEggs » Mon Sep 19, 2011 12:59 pm

I think I lost a few more. Lots of detritus on the larvae tank bottom. Might be some larvae laying in it. I'm going to try a small water change today siphoning out the detritus and dripping new water in. I would like to figure out a way to remove the larvae so I can put the tank water through a rotifer screen to get the rots out. I think the shrimp larvae are too fragile to move though.
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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby Suzy » Tue Sep 20, 2011 2:03 pm

I had them in mayonaise jars with just an air bubble in them. Once they grew, they had to be moved...
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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby Luis A M » Tue Sep 20, 2011 2:52 pm

Check for Calado´s paper which has been linked here lots of times.The good point of their method,is that you can remove all the uneaten bbs and feed again fresh ones.
The fastly wagged legs are the swimming legs.You must check the walking legs,which are jointed (with an "elbow)and more quiet and coloured.
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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby EasterEggs » Tue Sep 20, 2011 10:58 pm

Ah, very good Luis! This makes leg counting much easier! I believe they are zoea 2 right now by comparing photos you took on RC. They were in the trap on the morning of the 16th, so it the 16th 0 DPH or 1 DPH? They are either 4 or 5 DPH depending how I'm supposed to start counting.

This would be great to remove uneaten BBS, as i am not able to do this. I think there are 60 critters per mL in the larvae tank right now. Tonnes of rots, and lots of BBS. Some of the BBS are getting bigger. I will look more for Calado's paper - I was looking for pictures! :lol:

Suzy, how did you move them without damaging them?

---------------------------------------------------

I think there are about 20-25 shrimp larvae still in the tank. They sure are growing! Larval stage zoea 2 I believe.
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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby Luis A M » Wed Sep 21, 2011 1:58 pm

16th is day one.Peppers are not only easier but faster than the other Lysmata.They molt and change stage every 2 days,If you don´t check often,you could lose a stage! :wink:
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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby EasterEggs » Wed Sep 21, 2011 5:02 pm

It looks like most of them are Z3 today. A couple stragglers.
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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby EasterEggs » Wed Sep 21, 2011 5:03 pm

Oops double post. That was weird...
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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby EasterEggs » Thu Sep 22, 2011 5:14 pm

I have another (small) batch on the boiler today. Speaking of boilers, I almost nuked them as the heater was set at 88F! I put a couple ice cubes in the tank, and they seem to have survived this just fine. Maybe 40 larvae in this batch. I checked the trap at 4:30 am and thought I didn't see anything so I turned the LED off, so maybe they hatched after 4:30 am and with no LED only a few were caught. It was a smaller shrimp though.

Speaking of LEDs, what do you guys use? I'm going through a lot of batteries...there has to be a plug in model. Hmm...maybe at Petsmart or something with those fancy Betta tanks.

The first batch is at 7 DPH today, and they are doing well. They are quite big compared to the new batch, so that's good! They are all in Z3. I lose usually one per day, not sure why.
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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby EasterEggs » Thu Sep 22, 2011 9:27 pm

I jinxed myself...the first batch suddenly died this afternoon. My guess is ammonia as the tank is absolutely PACKED with rotifers, and lots of large artemia. I will test the tank for ammonia when the phyto has been cleared.

The second batch that is only 1 DPH had a rough start. I put a new heater in there that was stuck on and the tank zoomed up to 97F! Surprisingly (to me anyway) the boggessi larvae are still alive! :o
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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby EasterEggs » Fri Sep 23, 2011 11:08 am

Ammonia was off the chart. Chart goes to 8 ppm. :o I imagine all the dead larvae has contributed to this number though, so it is probably not that accurate. Either way, I realized yesterday after all the larvae died that I had forgotten to use an ammonia detoxifier in the larvae tanks! Newbie mistake. Dangit...

I have SeaChem Prime, I will start using this today on the 2 DPH batch.
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Re: Lysmata boggessi - EasterEggs

Postby Suzy » Sun Sep 25, 2011 8:04 pm

Sorry I missed this. I transfer with a turkey baster.

I hate heater mishaps...
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